Possible conclusions: Different to what I first thought.
Here is my dilemma? I have not made my mind up about this "Jesus, All about life." stuff, (I have my inclinations, and I would love to keep asking questions, and stirring the water) but I’m at a point where I almost don’t care anymore. I do not know which is worse; to be apathetic towards it, or to be either for or against.
It is something that zaps my energy; it has made me angry, confused and tired.
I think that it is something that I may continue to think about and debate. I may not ever agree or back it; but here is my conclusion; until it pisses me off again I am going to leave it alone.
I hope for the sake of the dollars being syphoned into the event that God will be glorified. I hope that who ever is organising the event has clear motives and agendas, because more than anything else these will be the only things standing at the end of it all. Like statues constantly reminding them of the day. If the intentions are to put the “Christian Church back on the map” (ie put bums on seats, and to put money back into church budgets, and pastors pockets) and not to put Jesus’ crazy message back on the social map; then God help them.
However, I also will not be the first to throw stones. I honestly hope and pray that people will come to faith through the process, and I hope and pray that people who come to faith will follow Jesus very closely, and follow him out of the nice safe fold into the wide-open world.
So here, I am at the crossroads. I know what I’m against (I think) but that’s easy. I have poured a lot of energy into the things that I am against; and as I stand at the crossroads, I am not sure what I am actually for, the only thing that I do know is that when I first said 'Jesus is Lord' it meant a lot less than what it does now.
In closing, I want to add some quotes from Henri Nouwens’ book “Reaching Out”
“Unless our questions and problems and concerns are tested and matured in solitude it is not realistic to expect answers that are really our own.”
Pre-occupations are our fearful ways of keeping things the same.
“’You think and talk too much; you must stop talking to yourself’… We maintain our world by inner talk. We talk to ourselves until everything is as it should be.”
So heres to a new journey. Heres to discovering what it is that I am for, heres to a Gracious God who allows us to journey.
posted by Josh and Melody @ 10:30 am
13 comments
13 Comments:
hey man,
good thoughts. I think it's great to sort out what we're against but more importantly i think it's about putting energy into living for Christ. Because it's from that, that change occurs and others see the goodness of HIM. But keeping searching and discovering and wrestling, it's good stuff, you've made me really think, and if you're causing that affect on people then you're making a difference!
Josh,
Have you read through all the background to JAAL on the JAAL web site? Just wanted to make sure you have understood it all before you decide not to get involved?
If you like, I could point you to some people on Canberra or Adelaide who took part.
BTW - Here's a challenge then, What would you do to raise the profile of Jesus in your community so that Christians could talk about him more easily?
martin.johnson@bigpond.com
Yeah mate I did read the background, and all the stuff about why use the media etc. I wanted to attach it and my critique of it, but I felt it not the right thing to do.
The second point you made was part of the reason for my latest addition on my blog. It is not that I am anti media or anything like that; it's just that I'm a little unsure.
I myself am actively involved in a community of faith within a lower socio-economic society within Launceston; and am discovering what it means to be a follower of Jesus with some of the marginalised within my city.
If I was going to do anything(and I'm not sure of the process), I think I would flatten out the Church as we know it, take the power from the hands of the paid officials of the church and the governing body's that have their grubby fingers in the pie and give the power back to the people. Jesus came to do that very thing, to reverse the power from the Governing body, and instead said, no; you no longer need the temple etc, "I am the way the truth and the life, no one gets to the father except through me." John 14:6. I think that in that process people from the churches would discover what it means to be a ‘Christian’ and the rest of the world may understand what it means when statements like, ‘Jesus, all about life’ get said. Instead of looking to a church who is so tightly bound up in their Sunday rituals to give a toss about the homeless and desperate people, they may be more inclined to say. “Hey I’ve seen those Christians, they believe in Jesus, They helped my mum, or they run that homeless shelter, or they hang live with the drug addicts up the road, they are good people!” But maybe I’m wrong?...
I don't want to lose sight in what I am for, and get worn out fighting the things I'm against.
So yes, Jesus came to give life but not as we too often interpret it.
(Martin with your permission, I would like to put on my critique of the arguments presented by your organisation, but only with your permission)
im not the one to give advice.. but..
do what u can mate.. + u are doing just that
a variation of a quote from V for Vendetta.. "satan uses truth to hide lies.. artists use lies to reveal truth."
Hey dude,
Does it worry you at all how quickly these guys swoop every time you post about this topic? There is a lot of spin surrounding this project.
I think it's like putting lipstick on a pig really. They can broadcast whatever message they like to "engage culture" and try and halt the decay of institutional church (from reading their website it seems to be a very clear intended goal) but if churches themselves remain the same, then no matter what people see on telly, their experiences with churches and the stereotypical Christian middle class will probably determine their attitude towards Christianity.
Rather than make Christianity culturally acceptable (because let's face it, it thrives most where it isn't acceptable) we need to make it real. And to do that we need to be in people's loungerooms in person, not via the idiot box.
These things always help someone (thank God for that) but it cannot be seen as the primary outreach (or is that inpull?) focus for the church in Australia. We need to engage the world as sent ones - missionaries.
And Josh, I love how you can answer questions as one who is doing something and making a difference.
i think grubb picks up on something here.. i think will come out of JAAL..
my hope is that JAAL will be a mirror showing up some of the inadequacies (+ hopefully when we recognise the problem can we go about constructively reforming a solution).. i think it will prove to be a pig with lipstick.. this pig/church is in drastic need to be something more than it currently is.. we are representing Jesus.. we should never be content with how beautiful we are.. but what is needed is more than just lipstick
we should be vibrant communities of faith + life.. the sorts of ppl that ppl want to hang out with.. not have to.
ppl involved in marketing have the job to convince ppl they need something that in actual fact they don't.. the adds will convince ppl of a need but whether or not this need will be met by the follow-up is questionable.
my understanding is that ppl will watch the adds + go 'wow' i want what they've got.. i dont want religion.. but i sure want to be spiritual + i want a smile on my face like those ppl on the tele.. then they ring the hotline..
now for the consumer to get to JESUS + the life that they saw on tele, they have to go to church + hang out with christians..
but how on earth is anyone going to be content to sit in church on sunday after seeing adds about life..
the adds are fine.. the product(the church not JESUS) is the problem.
Guys
Thanks for posting again and Josh, maybe you can e-mail me direct rather than post your critique - although that's up to you. Happy to look at it.
mjohnson@biblesocietynsw.com.au
... You're right - one of our concerns was what happens if people actually go to a church, but we've found that so far, the churches that people are likely to go to, are the ones that get involved and are alive and active.
And for us, Jesus is the product.
... some comments about us swooping after each comment, but you can hardly expect us to stay quiet, surely? Isn't what blogging is about?
We're open to hearing from you guys so we can make sure the campaign we've developed works in every market ....
Martin Johnson
Martin - first let me say that I'm impressed in the way you have conducted yourself while we've been debating the merits of this project (which you are obviously a stakeholder in - it's hard not to be emotional about the things we are committed to, so props to you).
I think you need to understand us in order to understand our misgivings (and I speak at least on behalf of myself and Josh). We are young committed Jesus-followers who have found the traditional western church to be quite unscriptural in many ways and burdened with top-heavy leadership and an adherence to unnecessary human traditions that tend to encourage inactive Christians. We have found that our friends respond positively to Jesus, but are repelled by church (and the "Ned Flanders" stereotype Christians, who are unfortunately very common.) We have also found that rather than the church (in Australia at least) being in the world but not of it, the church tends to not be in the world at all... A problem which I believe you probably share in common with us.
We believe that rather than outreach (or indrag) where churches try and suck people out of the world into the safe haven of the church, we need to be missionaries - to go out into the world and restore it from the bottom up. Our reference for this idea is Jesus himself, who became a man to reach mankind. He didn't suck people out of the world but allowed them to truly live in it, and this is how he made his impact.
I reckon you're probably still with us this far, right?
So it's probably not your ad campaign that is the problem as much as it is the sustainability - where do people go to get "life" - if they see the ads and decide they need it?
The church as it presently practices Christianity (and this is a generalisation - of course there are exceptions) does not have the ability to engage culture (which is where you are stepping in) and it has no clue what to do with people next, or how to offer people life in Christ. (many churches swap this for religious observance).
The other problem is with the way you are engaging the culture. 30 second tv ads might create a talking point, and I think it's great to put something out there for people to talk about.
But the church needs to be able to offer the life that you refer too. Someone needs to be there in that person's life already to grab a hold of any opportunity your ads might create. In other words, somebody has to be out there engaging the world as a missionary.
Fair comment about the swooping, that IS what blogging is all about - having your say.
I just had mine =)
Shite! Grubb well... i do not know where to go. Martin I would love to share my queries on the blog but I'll hold them for a while firstly, I don't see you as swooping, I'm flattered that you would even comment for starters, and I thought that my thoughts didn’t travel too far. Mate I think it is only fair of you to try to answer as many questions as possibly to make the transition as smooth as possible, especially when there is so much invested into it.
Grubb what you said is a very fair comment mate, and you shared a lot of my thoughts. Cheers.
I will add my thoughts on another entry.
martin is a legend..
grubb is a legend..
josh is a legend..
it is lovely to see everyone 'getting on' even amongst heated debate.. i can smell God here..
lets push each other in action as well as thought transaction for the sake of the kingdom.. where do we go from here??
Dont forget Urbanmonk... Hes a legend too:)
hey we are all legends. Look I'm the boss, so I have now promoted everyone who reads this to be now a legend. So thats you too urbs!!!
:) Ahh it's nice to be a legend!
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